You just don’t get it — A rebuttal to Lo-Pie’s post about the Saint Laurent (YSL) and Burger Records party

YSL Saint Laurent Burger Records

Photo via Kim & The Created’s Facebook

In the mid-to-late 90s when I was in high school, I was into underground punk and hip-hop, even some house and electronic music. Some of my favorite acts included Operation Ivy, Bad Religion, Gang Starr, Pharcyde… the list goes on. I recall the first time I heard Southern California punk bands Face To Face and Bad Religion on mainstream radio (KROQ to be exact), and how angry my immature self was. “What sell outs!,” I thought to myself and how their music would never sound the same to me. Little did I know that “selling out” can be a great thing for any artist or creative that has endured the struggle.

So last night while winding down the work day, I took a moment to look through my Facebook app. The first item that appeared on my feed was from fellow music blog, Lo-Pie. As I always tell my writers, it’s all about the headline, and Lo-Pie’s headline definitely caught my attention: “Sick Sad Scene: YSL x Burger.” As I read the headline, I thought to myself how much I hate that tired word, “scene.”

I read the article to completion, and was confused. I was frustrated. I almost didn’t know what the point of the post was. It came off like an angry millennial rant, or someone who just didn’t get it. I hate to say it, but the article seems “young and dumb.” Although very well written with clean syntax and an intelligent use of words, the post lacked substance. The writer came off pretentious and with a superior tone. And trust me, “nearly five years of covering Southern California’s underground scene” barely qualifies someone to be a self-declared authority on defining who is and what is real underground.

The Lo-Pie post is all about the recent Saint Laurent (YSL) party that went off last week at the Hollywood Palladium. With local Los Angeles bands Bleached, Kim & The Created, No Parents and more slated to perform, all the indie/underground music kids wanted an invite. It’s not every day that a high fashion brand like Saint Laurent teams up with some very under the radar bands. Mainstream musicians are usually booked for that kind of shit. And that’s what was really cool about this event; the fact that they did not book your typical Lady Gaga or Foo Fighters, but instead chose to give the spotlight to underground acts. Sure, Beck and Joan Jett were on the bill, but the majority of acts were the kind of bands that people that attend fashion shows don’t know about. To top it all off, the marketing campaigns for the big event featured some great work with bands like Bleached, Kim & The Created and more. And judging by the enthusiastic updates on their social media, the bands were stoked to be a part of such a grand opportunity. This was a POSITIVE thing!

I cannot stand when a person takes something that is clearly positive, and spins it into something negative. And that is exactly what the Lo-Pie writer did in this article.

First off, chill with the fuckin’ dramatics. I find it extremely hard to believe that attending this YSL event made the writer “both physically and mentally sick.”

In the post, the writer pretty much attacks YSL creative director Hedi Slimane, calling him a “carpetbagger” and “someone who’s true talent lies not in creating but in correctly identifying creative centers before they pop, which he then aligns himself with and sucks dry before moving on when the wellspring turns to mud.” She pretty much talks as though she has first-hand experience with the dude. Which she clearly does not, otherwise she would have used a personal experience to build strength behind her claim (which would have positively supported her post). As a journalist, you never rely on hearsay, in an effort to attack someone’s integrity. Especially someone you don’t know on a personal level. In an effort to support her claims, and appear somewhat not subjective, the writer pulls a quote from New York Magazine and decided to interpret it in her own twisted way.

What really peeves me is how the writer makes all the exposure the artists received (high profile magazine placements, billboards, runways shows, etc.) seem like a bad thing. Are you fucking kidding me? This is so damn awesome for a band that has like 4,000 fans on their Facebook page. Do you know how many local L.A. bands would have loved this opportunity? It’s beyond me how the writer sees this as something negative. These artists are getting paid for their craft. Who are you to judge the means behind it? If a band decided to stay away from corporate entities, than good for them. But if another band decided they want to broaden their audience, and make some bills by working with a high profile business, which some would call “selling out,” than good for them too.

Exploiting an artist is when you use them for their talents for your own financial gain, and not give them any sort of payment in return. Whether cash money or trade, it’s up to the artist’s discretion what makes them satisifed. If they are okay with it, you should not be judging and throwing shade. A perfect example of exploiting an artist is what McDonalds did last year at SXSW with Ex Cops and a few other underground acts. That’s exploiting. That’s capitalism at its finest. YSL and Burger are nowhere near that. Instead they did, and do, something great for local bands.

Do you really think YSL or Slimane had any huge gain from this? I might be wrong, but the last time I checked, most indie/underground show-goers can barely afford a concert ticket. At least 30 percent of Grimy Goods ticket giveaway entries are a plea for concert tickets because they are broke. I’m pretty sure these same kids aren’t going to be purchasing YSL’s spring line just because they went to the afterparty where their favorite local bands were performing.

The gain here is for the artists that were a part of the entire campaign, whether they performed or not. Can you imagine how many rich fashion snobs now know about their music, and their look? Maybe that stylish socialite will pay them a ridiculous amount of money to perform at her 40th birthday party, maybe that director wants them to be the featured band in their next film because they liked their look on that billboard, or maybe that television show producer wants to feature their song in a season finale. The possibilities are endless, and are most definitely a positive thing, so please don’t go making this into something negative.

If YSL gets a little “coolness” validation attached to their brand after all this, so be it. I think that hardly counts as “sucking them dry.” Pretty sure these bands came out the other side for the better.

On top of all that nonsense, the writer then goes to chastise Burger Records for having a “swollen ego” while in “quest for world domination.” Really though, this isn’t a soap opera, are all those negative dramatics necessary?

She then goes on to claim that Burger Records “seem happy to align themselves with just about anyone who comes their way, even those from the exclusive and elite enclaves of the fashion industry.” Again, the writer is full of subjective words with no substance to support her claims. And this is where the negative connotation of “selling out” comes into play. So Burger hooked up with YSL for this massive afterparty, well good for fucking them! There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. Do you even know what it’s like to dedicate so many years of your life to a passion project that does not bare any fruits for quite some time? An opportunity such as teaming up with YSL is not only huge for Burger, but huge for everyone under their roster. So when the writer puts Burger down for this, she is essentially putting down all the bands Burger works with too. People need to get paid! They need to pay for rent, pay for meals, clothes on their back, etc. And then I think to myself, this writer is an idiot. No, she’s not an idiot, she’s just lacking perspective. She doesn’t know the hard work of creating something from scratch all on your own and to finally see years of labor come to fruition. She doesn’t know how a once underground hobby or passion project that becomes lucrative is beneficial not only to the creator, but to all those involved. I can relate to this on a personal level with my growth with Grimy Goods. I’ve been called a “sell out” and what not for partnering with big brands or supporting mainstream radio. In the grand scheme of things, the writer just doesn’t get it, and she probably never will until she goes through being the creator of something that was once underground that has evolved into a lucrative business that still stays true to its roots. It’s the same scenario with artists. They get the opportunity to go mainstream and finally make money, and then they get called sell outs for doing so.

Sadly, the writer then goes on to shame Burger Records even more, which gives the impression she has a personal vendetta against them or something. It really is strange. I personally have never had any problems working with these dudes. And I most certainly have never felt an inkling of ego from them either. In fact, I’ve never heard anything but good things from friends in bands that work with Burger. Again, maybe if the writer would give us some hard evidence, or facts, or first-hand experience — there might be some validity to her incessant rants and complaints. I mean, who really cares about Burger’s use of “ALL CAPS” and “smiley emojis.” I certainly don’t. But I do care about real factual claims, not subjective hodgepodge gussied up with elevated words and formal syntax. Ain’t nobody got time for that!

Finally, for the writer to criticize how the YSL’s event was run, is truly ridiculous, and this is where the article shifts into being pretentious. If you’re going to tout the fact that you’ve been “covering Southern California’s underground scene” how you gonna complain about a free show with great bands and free everything just because it “ran behind schedule” or had some “indiscriminate serving of alcohol.” Your privileged ass should be stoked you even got into this awesome FREE event.

I can’t tell you how many underground shows I’ve been to where kids are being served alcohol, where bands don’t show up, where bands come on two hours late — and here the writer is complaining about these things (*facepalm). Wouldn’t you be accustomed to it by now? It’s not like it’s an unusual occurrence at a show. I can’t even imagine this writer at a REAL underground show where you buy your ticket at one location, and then are given directions to the venue where the live music is happening, only to show up and the shit is already shut down by the cops. She would have been a very angry girl in the 90s.

To further note, this is the first time YSL has ever dabbled into the local Los Angeles music scene on such a broad scale. No inaugural music event goes well the first time. I guess the writer never attended the first time FYF was held at the Los Angeles State Historic Park, or any Coachella before 2005 — those things were a hot mess and not successful until years later. No event is perfect the first time around, and for the writer to nitpick at such menial things feels like the article is grasping at anything it can to devalue the event. What it really does is devalue the very point the writer is trying to support.

The only negative thing about the YSL event, was the claim that a kid fell off the balcony. I’ve only heard this news from one artist who’s set got canceled due to the fall, and I can’t find anything in the news about it. I’ve searched online and have yet to find anything. But if someone did indeed fall off the balcony and seriously injured himself or herself, that’s a real bummer. It doesn’t mean you should place blame on the organizers for ending the event and canceling all remaining performances. I’m pretty sure that’s what legally needs to be done, and I’m positive the Hollywood Palladium would not allow any event to continue after such a critical accident. Again, there’s a business side to this music world that the writer just doesn’t understand (or is conveniently ignoring). Insurance? Legal? Yeah, these things and more take priority of “does this decision reflect the value of our underground community?”

Also, this isn’t the first time someone has fallen off the Palladium balcony

At first glance, I thought the writer, was onto something fierce with her Lo-Pie article. The headline screamed for attention in our underground music “scene” and her intro paragraph alluded to something deep. When you express that a show made you feel “both physically and mentally sick” you best have some legit proof to support your feels. Unfortunately, this post had no solid proof to support any of her words. You can call her post, purely a subjective rant. And don’t get me wrong, it’s totally okay to rant. I do it all the time, but I don’t make it public while totally attacking the integrity of two very familiar names in music and fashion. And if I were to, you best believe I’d have my concrete details on fleek.

Look, I’m not out here to attack other writers. This is an opportunity to discuss and reflect on what’s truly important. I wrote this to perhaps enlighten the writer and her supporters, and drop some knowledge on something she has yet to fully understand due to lack of experience or immaturity.

I was once that angry kid full of angst against the system, against any form of order, but as I come up on my eighth year of running Grimy Goods, you see a lot of other angles in this music world that aren’t always talked about for fear they might not be “cool.”

Words: Sandra Burciaga / Founder and Editor of Grimy Goods

34 thoughts on “You just don’t get it — A rebuttal to Lo-Pie’s post about the Saint Laurent (YSL) and Burger Records party

  1. Fela Kuti

    Why do you care about someones opinion on music? Im glad someone gave their opinion and put burger on blast, to write an entire article about how your 2 opinions don’t match up is childish and dumb.

  2. Sandy Post author

    James St. James — You’re very misinformed, but I’m flattered that you actually think this little blog makes that much money. If we got paid for our show reviews or features on new music and new artists, we’d be rich! Have you even taken a look at our current banner ads? I’m guessing you didn’t, because if you did you would see that we have not written about any of those bands except for Ra Ra Riot. Our writer loved the album and asked if he could write a review. And the rest of the bands featured on our current homepage posts don’t even have banners ads for them… And yes, you saying the bands that were booked at the YSL event “sucked” is indeed your own “personal problem.” Anywho, thanks for sharing your opinion.

  3. James St James

    Haven’t seen a comment on here or Lo Pie about the bands YSL picked suck. One thing both articles fail bring up is how music in both the underground and mainstream is rife with nepotism. Bands that get opportunities to perform at quality shows at decent venues (Official and DIY) and get written about in blogs like this is because of nepotism and/or someone paid or got paid.

    Talent rarely has anything to do with popularity, example Burger Records. I really don’t care what their business practices are, exposure is exposure, BUT! where is the quality assurance? I guess it didnt start out that way so guess its hard to expect it. Maybe its a personal problem, I do enjoy Burger/Lolipop bands, they are entertaining, but I have yet to see any rock/indie based bands in L.A. do anything new or able to play their instrument or write a decent song with depth. Why does no one question that? Liking the person and liking their band can be mutually exclusive, ie it not a personal attack on anyone but L.A bands are lazy philosophically as in they arnt really pushing the art, too much lazy retro revivalism, especially in the garage and psych bands which i find especially ironic considering the bands they emulate didnt sound like anything before them and were pushing the art foreword to evolve and grow, seems to go over those involved with Burger, Lolipop, and “journalist” of L.A., but alas its not like the rest of the rock scenes in LA are doing better. All revival rehash.

    Next time you are reading a feature about the next upcoming band or a show review, remember that it was paid job. I understand that writers need to get paid for their work, but arn’t the articles that are written about the bands or venues the same ones you see in banner ads on the side of the blog? Not saying that is a bad thing but dont come at me that there is integrity in the articles written in that the bands and/or venues were picked because of talent

    Again a personal problem but I just dont think the bands were that good. More show than anything, cool your running around on stage or your all dressed in 60’s garb or running around naked, just feels like a distraction for poorly written songs. We are a generation raised by AYSO…

  4. W

    Everybody should just read Cliffnotes reply. If you’re still mad at Lo-Pie after that, you’re just dumb.

  5. CliffsNotes

    PS…Let the judgements on the writing style go. In the same story you praised the writing style and then said the writing style was awful. Stick to the points the article made. We all make mistakes.

    – <3 The writer who made a shit ton of mistakes in his response.

  6. CliffsNotes

    Okay, clearly a lot of you kids need the Lo-Pie article to be in CliffsNotes form because it seems the overall message of this went right over your heads. Not only was I there, but I also work professionally in the music industry where I’ve been to many events like this and have worked with many bands in this “scene.” Maybe I can give some point of view from a professional standpoint. I know some you kids don’t like reading but bear with me…

    I’m going to go through a run down of what many of you are outraged about in this article.

    * “All underground shows start late, have drunk people and have issues! If you don’t like it, stop going to shows!”

    You’re right. Many underground shows are poorly organized, run over time and are filled with shit faced kids and people. Yet, THIS WASN’T AN UNDERGROUND SHOW. It was a god damn fashion show put on by one of the biggest names in fashion at one of the most legendary venues in rock and roll, the Palladium! Beck played. Father John Misty played. JOAN JETT played. This wasn’t an underground show. This was a show, presented essentially as a glamours party INSPIRED by the underground scene. Therefore, the organization of this show, especially in regards to the “underground” bands they had on the bill, should have been handled as professionally as possible. Here are some tips on how this could have gone better

    A) You don’t put a band like Allah Las after Joan Jett. They’re a sleepy psych / surf band. One of two that night with Mystic Braves also being on the bill. You want people to stay for all of these underground artists you’re celebrating? Put the damn Sloths on next or Kim and the Created or fucking Bleached or No Parents! Literally, every other band aside from Mystic Braves could have saved the energy in that room and perhaps more people would have stayed. I was standing in the back of the venue during their set and saw the mass exodus of people saying how awful the set was. Sorry dudes.

    B) Shows always go late but NEVER in Los Angeles does a show continue to go until 4am. Once again, you want people to stay to see these amazing up and coming bands you discovered? Make sure they go on earlier. Maybe stagger the big name bands and the little bands? Maybe NOT book so many bands so they play to 60 people in the Palladium at 3am. Maybe only book, 4 bands and have the Burger dudes or WHOEVER DJ the rest of the night. (The DJ was on point I have to say.) Booking SO many bands and having the event go so incredibly late isn’t helping the bands you hoped to help.

    * “Fuck you for judging these bands for playing and doing this. They got exposure, billboards, ads in the NY times. This helped their career! That, AND they are getting helped from Hedi!”

    Agreed. To a point. Once again, I work in music and the reality is bands don’t make a lot of money off records or shows anymore. The money comes in from music licensing and doing events like this. No judgement! It’s incredibly badass when someone huge like YSL wants to work with tiny bands who might not “even be known on their block”!

    Yet, here’s the problem. On ALL of those billboards, print ads, and posters hanging around the city of our beloved local bands, NONE of them actually featured the band name. Even Hedi’s photobook doesn’t include the names of the bands or members that he’s photographing. So tell me, how does that help these small bands? Sure, they share the ads on their socials and tell their families and such, but what about people outside of that circle?

    By not including their names on all of the promo materials takes away the power of those people being “the faces of Los Angeles underground music” to simply being punk rock looking models. So now, when a music sup. picks up that ad they think “Huh, cool model.” Instead of “I wonder what No Parents sounds like?”

    * “Okay but what about the show? It’s amazing they gave those bands an opportunity to play with Beck, JJ and FJM and MAYBE someone in the crowd could have seen them and use them for other events or fashion spreads.”

    True! But once again, with the failure of not being able to forecast the energy drop (Allah Las), and having so many bands play so late into the night, all of those people who COULD have done something? Fucking left. Once again, people who work in music and fashion, ACTUALLY dont like staying out until 4 in the morning. We go to SO many of these things people become more jaded and you have to work for their attention. I know that’s shitty, but it’s the truth and the people organizing the schedule should have known that.

    Also, the lineup of who was playing that night was NEVER revealed to the public or advertised at all. Don’t you think if this were truly a night of celebrating these bands they would try to not only mention their clothing line, but ALSO try to always mention the bands that were helping them advertise and play their event?

    * “But I had fun! Why make this negative?”

    Great! You had fun! I had fun! Bands had fun! The writer seemed to have fun, to a point. (Check the Lo-Pie socials), but this article wasn’t about YOU having fun. It’s about how this night was advertised as a night celebrating local up and coming acts yet, aside from a 15 second video on instagram and the YSL site, they certainly made an effort to not advertise the bands or musicians.

    Anyone who truly cares about the success of these bands should be equally excited for them and the opportunity AND disappointed in how little “exposure” they were actually given.

    * “FINE! Where are the facts? This is slander! This is illegal!”

    No it’s fucking not. This article is strictly observational and is more philosophical than an EXPOSE. Everything this person said is out of observing what was going on. Need proof? It’s out there as plain as day to see.

    Okay now… Burger Records.

    * “Why are you talking shit on Burger? They’ve done so much for local bands and the scene!”

    Yes they have! Once again, to a point. When Burger started out, it was a label trying to help PROMOTE bands that they loved and played in. It was a label that started as a place where hopefully they could give their friends more exposure to like minded people. By doing that, it was great! They’ve really created something special.

    BUT sometime in the last few years if you pay attention, the focus has now been on BURGER not the BANDS. They advertise bands as “BURGER BANDS” grab a “BURGER CLASSIC”! Have you gotten enough BURGER? Somewhere the focus changed from bands being the focus to BURGER being the focus. SO many bands want to have something out on Burger for the simple sake of having the “Burger” stamp on it in hopes that it will give them more exposure. For awhile that worked but now it’s not that way. I’ve counted. In 2015, Burger released on AVERAGE about 2 releases for everyday of the calendar year. How can a consumer OR music journalist OR music supervisor keep up with such output? It seems to have become a place where they’ll throw anything at the wall and wait to see what sticks. And when they stick? WELCOME TO BURGERAMA!

    Once again, you can admire and appreciate Burger Records while also criticizing. I have great hope for those dudes to recalibrate or maybe take a look at other labels they admire. Perhaps they can wind down on the output and focus on boosting the bands they personally think have some quality (and trust me, there are a lot of small “Burger” bands made up of poor kids that could us the added boost.)

    I’ll leave you with this…

    Though this article is clearly written out of anger and frustration, isn’t that a good thing? Isn’t it good that someone cares SO much about the bands involved that they risked putting their publication AND themselves on the line?

    With this article, everyone can continue talking shit or go play more shows or simply ignore it. This small blog vocally stated a clearly unpopular opinion and risked being blacklisted by everyone involved. For a blog whose whole world is centered around this scene, they must of cared a fuck ton to risk that.

  7. Maria

    I never heard of Lo pie and clearly its a low blow. Why all the hate? A couple of downers, jealous people, and angry people we are dealing with. It’s sad to me. People need to chill out. Everyone and their mamas should start a band. I known Lee and Sean since high school. I’m happy for them. They both have worked really hard. I say let the people be grumpy/jealous and dont stoop to their level of hate.

  8. R

    Are you fucking kidding me?! you’re trying to appeal to us by saying you like “Operation Ivy, Bad Religion” YOU FUCKING SUCK.
    Oh and did you check your hella time Facebook app for updates on LA night life you fucking dork.
    There is nothing punk about you or your website, fuck off poser.

    “I cannot stand when a person takes something that is clearly positive, and spins it into something negative. And that is exactly what the Lo-Pie writer did in this article.” then a few paragraphs later you say “Your privileged ass should be stoked you even got into this awesome FREE event.” Rude. Dude you’re whole article is shitting on someone’s opinion when you could have ignored it and focused on the positive yourself by just writing about why the event was great in your opinion. You’re no better than the insults you sent toward Lo Pie.
    “I wrote this to perhaps enlighten the writer and her supporters, and drop some knowledge on something she has yet to fully understand due to lack of experience or immaturity.” Yeah….clearly dude….

    sweet plug on your shitty burger cover at the end too…. LOL

  9. LA "Underground" Musician

    1. Seriously. Why all the hate on Burger Records? I’ve been reading the comments not just here, but everywhere. Why people hating so much? As Grimy’s article pointed out, I want to hear actual evidence/experience as to why the Burger dudes are assholes. If your only claim is because you feel they’re selling out — then you’re a total dick wad.

    2. Whether or not YSL was getting a cool factor by working with these bands, it doesn’t really matter. The bands were totally ok with it and getting compensated. The bands were positive about the experience. So why you sticking your big fat nose into something that has nothing to do with you and creating this negative cloud of energy over our music community. I’m taking to you, Lo Pie.

    3. Lo Pie is a huge, attention seeking hypocrite. If you’re gonna hate on an event, why are you going to post all these Instagrams while at the event, showing your having a good time rocking out to Joan Jett and what not? I’ve enjoyed some
    of the work on Lo Pie, but they’ve lost my respect after their recent post. And on top of that, what kind of person sponsors a Facebook post on a negative review about The Frights new album? Oh yes, Lo Pie does. They are the new click bait.

    4. The only thing great that came out of Lo Pies immature blog post was Grimy’s rebuttal post.

  10. Music Supervisor

    Not gonna lie, I had no idea what or who is Lo Pie until reading this post. Naturally, I visited their site and read their juvenile rant.

    The comments on here are hilarious. To even claim that “nobody takes Grimy Gooods seriously” is absolute comedy to me, and a very jealous statement. I’ve been coming to this blog for years scouting out talent for films, TV, commercials… Every small and major label I work with respects this blog. It’s no surprise why all the big brands have advertised here and collaborated with Grimy. I’m obviously a huge fan of this site, but I’ve also been able to see it grow the past few years. To top it all off it was started by a very intelligent, and music savy woman at a time where there were maybe 3 LA music blogs, and absolutely no females running a blog of large reach in Los Angeles. Now everyone has jumped on the bandwagon to copy what this here blog has done.

    Throwing out rude comments about Grimy Goods integrity or reach on the LA music community only shows how little you know, and how much of a hater you are.

    Yo Grimy, you already know this, but if you’re getting hated on, you’re doing an excellent job.

    Superb article.

  11. Andrew

    in the past i’ve played events hosted by grimy goods, lo-pie and burger records. of those three only one was noticeably disorganized, bordering on what could be considered a trainwreck. want to take a guess which?

    any organic aspect of “the scene” died in 2014. from a business aspect i’m not gonna knock sean or lee for jumping at the opportunity because those dudes work hard and, from what i hear, are massively in debt. nor am I going to pass judgement on the artist because let’s face it, playing music is dedicating one’s self to perpetual poverty. but if you’re going to defend the ysl show as something authentic and not a massive corporate ego stroke then you’re ignorant and ill informed.

    those bands were used as a marketing tool, to highlight how “in-tune” the ysl brand is to alternative youth culture. same as the individuals from these bands they regularly parade down the catwalk. if those people are willing participants in being exploited then fine, that is their choice. but let’s not kid ourselves, that’s what it is. that’s exactly what Lo-Pie was arguing; it was a poorly-run corporate farce packaged as something organic or real, and that is the tell-tale sign of a sick and dying scene. the salt in the wound is underage kids apparently being allowed into such an event. European high fashion and a music label that was put together because of a lack of safe all-ages venues in Orange County where kids can foster a scene in a safe environment? doesn’t quite make sense, does it?

    lo-pie’s article is the canary in the cole mine.

    btw, the poorly run event? it was hosted by Burger. Grimy Goods treated my band and I well. This article is way far up it’s ass though and reads more like blatant buddy-pandering to the artists that were featured by YSL than any coherent assessment of what the show was, or what it represents.

  12. Terry T

    Look folks, we can all be unique snowflakes without worrying about how Burger Records’ next move is going to ruin the authenticity of your scene. I think this article is making a great point that we all need to chill the fuck out a little bit and not be on this constant witch hunt for every little thing that threatens how legit the scene is. I get it, humans are pack animals by nature and driven to form groups and go all beast mode when something or someone threatens our understanding of the pack. Wanna do something really punk and underground? Stop getting your panties in a twist when something good no matter how much it’s in the public eye happens for an artist. The arts should be celebrated, not categorized and locked up only shown to the self-declared elite few that noticed one category slightly earlier than the majority. And seriously, what the hell did Burger Records do to all you haters? Did they sneak into your house and steal your dog? Chill out snowflakes, you’re still unique, it’s your perspectives that are played out. Rock on GrimyGoods!

  13. Me Myself and I

    Well done, Grimy Goods. Kudos for speaking out on this topic. Hateful comments in support of Lo Pies immature post only supports your article even more. When people don’t have anything intelligent to say, they insult the other party, a true sign of weakness.

    Keep up the fabulous work. What you and your staff do for bands/artists that want to get their name out there, and for kids that want to attend shows but can’t afford it, is truly something special.

  14. Anonymous

    lol when you see lo-pie rocking out and singing during Joan Jett’s set and having a good time, then they go on to write a negative review.

  15. black Chris

    first of all you write like an 8th grader…second of all no one is saying the exposure any of these bands received was a bad thing if anything they didn’t receive ENOUGH exposure and were just used to add to the “rock n roll” image ysl is going for at this very moment. also Kim and the created is so fucking terrible holy shit that act is so played out…same with no parents…these bands bring nothing cool or original they’re just some 5th wave punk “rehash” that still shocks idiots like you into thinking their cool by throwing drinks on themselves and writing on the floor *woo!* God burger records is fucking played out its not even that they are sellouts dude the music is just soooooo fake. any show with one of those bands I can never take them seriously they look like they’re posing so hard it hurts. yea lets talk about the new mystic braves album oh I mean allah las oh I mean the growlers oh I mean WHO GIVES A FUCK SUPPORT GOOD MUSIC NOT AN AESTHETIC

  16. Sarah

    You clearly don’t understand much about exploitation. One can be exploited while being compensated. That event was a train wreck. None of those kids give a shit about art or music or developing themselves as writers with a unique voice in music. It’s group think mob mentality and all a washed up, watered down version of music from the past which was original at the time it came out. Your blog grimy goods is terrible. The writing is terrible. Your ideas are terrible. Your taste is terrible, hot topic, mall garbage. I would never expect you or your blog to understand an article which contained such nuance and free thinking. Stick to your mob mentality and the idea that fast loud music is good. You’re just promoting more garbage. The rest of us are ready to call bullshit and hope for a
    Time when original ideas and intellect are present in underground music.

  17. honesty

    this piece is embarrassing. a poorly written response to an incredibly well written and apt article about the LA music scene’s corporate hierarchy in the guise of the “DIY alternative.” This piece actually furthers every argument Lo Pie made so thank you for posting this.

  18. A music lover

    It’s nice to see this post getting some really thought out, and eloquent discussion on a topic that is quite important to any underground music scene. While I definitely agree with the Grimy Goods article, a couple comments on here did bring up some valid points, but not enough to make up for the jealous sounding lashing that the Lo Pie author gave. I wanted to comment on their blog post as well, but it was so full of kitty litter comments, that I just couldn’t.

    And to whoever “S” is, you sound like an angry little troll. Quit hating and adding idiocy to this thread, or leave something that promotes positive discussion. Ricki Lake? Totally don’t get it.

  19. Emellie

    Hmmmmm…. While the lo-pie article may have taken liberties to shine a spotlight on the YSL shit show and the writers contempt for the collusion it seems you too are picking and choosing your facts. The burger bands were not being fairly compensated (most not at all) nor were/are any of them ever sporting “original looks” deemed worthy of the tag “inspirational”. There was nothing original about the “artistry” on display musicly or visually. The “poor” kids that cannot afford tickets were (allowed to be) there and willfully/ignorantly put on display as some sort of plea for credibility as well as for the amusement of the upper echelons that were given the night off to do their cool hunting. Lady gaga was there, josh homme (fake greaser look on fleek), courtney love, lenny kravitz were all given front row seats to view the $hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of merchandise labeled “rock n roll chic”. There was no “selling out” going on as that in fact would not have been such a bad thing if one were to really believe any of those bands on the bill were worth anything more than a 99 cent cassette but the fact of the matter is there was not one “truly original” artist slated to perform outside of joan jett and beck and THEY were paid. There was nothing good nor positive about the event albeit nothing terrible or shocking either. It was just another “night out” for the pathetically unoriginal entitled lemmings looking for the next thing/artist to rip off on a night advertised to serve them some truly fresh meat. The most unfortunate aspect of this event is that there was absolutely nothing new, truly fresh or original being offered up on the runway or the stage. That anyone was lead to believe they were in for “something different” must have added to the sense of dissatisfaction on display in the lo-pie read.

  20. Anonymous

    BRAVO! When I first read the Lo- Pie article, I immediately felt that this person had some kind of personal vendetta as if scorned and using the event as some sort of catalyst to display her internal anger. I was actually a bit surprised because I have read some very well done pieces by this publication. I have been following the underground “punk” and “DIY” stuff for more years than I care to admit (like 35 years or better haha) and like yourself, feel the very same way in regard to , well basically everything you have stated. I will never understand why some feel that artist should work for free. Have they no idea what it takes for these bands to get even 5 minutes of recognition for the art they so painstakingly create, tirelessly, day in and day out, trying to make a living at doing what they dedicate every waking moment too? Would anyone expect any other occupation to work for free? I think not! If not for Burger Records, half of these bands would have never been heard outside of their garages, and Kudos to Hedi and YSL for giving some of these bands an extra leg up! I am not a musician nor have I ever aspired to be, but I do have a personal connection to a lot of these bands and see first hand how they work their asses off and how much it means to them. Thank you for not keeping quiet and so elequently as always driving a very needed point home!!

  21. Echo Park

    Honey, no music writer or publication in LA worth their salt takes you or your silly little site seriously. You’re not an unbiased outsider. You sit nicely in the pockets of the labels and promoters in town, getting free tickets and free entrance to events in exchange for some ego stroking in the form of the article. The fact that you felt a need to respond with what are essentially playground taunts — “There are MY friends and YOU DON’T KNOW THE REAL THEM!” — to what was a really well-argued, well-thought out article just proves how far up on Burger’s dick you are. Mariana knows more about music and writing than you ever would, and just because you think she’s not worthy of commenting on it because she’s only been back in the area for five years, doesn’t mean shit. Do you complain when a NY blog writes about an LA band?

  22. William Mendoza

    Well written, well said, and you backed it all up. We should all first and for most support local music. I don’t understand why the lo pie author was trying to make everything about the event so negative. Stop trying to be cool.

    I’m not sure what the commenter “S” is talking about either. He makes no sense. Sounds like he’s Honey Boo Boo or has some speech disability. Go get an education “S” and then you can join us in a smart discussion.

  23. S

    Oh look. The dumb opinion: “It was fun party” and “Those are my pals”. Burger Fans are like a fat bitch at the Ricki Lake show “Ya’ll just jealous!” — This was nothing but a lot of what’s already been said & some character attacks. No ideology, no logic, no nothin’. This sounds like Aldo’s speech after Connor KO’d him in one punch. Why did you just go and continue to prove Lo-Pie right? And please for the love of Zombie Jeebess! Take an English class. Get an editor.

  24. GinaB

    Well said! Clearly the writer from Lo-Pie is someone who just writes because they can and not because they want to succeed and grow. I’m sure if ever acknowledged on a grander scale and have a national publication call on them to be syndicated on a higher level they will unabashedly decline because they wouldn’t want to “sell out” their craft. SMDH…

  25. Deven

    Been waiting for this, Grimy Goods! Finally someone has written a great piece to counter Lo Pie’s silly post. All points covered. Solid work!!!

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